Do You Want Them Installed?

I started the research of replacement windows with a review of the information on Consumer Reports. My dad wouldn’t buy anything that cost more than $100 without first researching it on Consumer Reports. The nice thing about CR is that it does not accept advertising dollars. This eliminates the perception that advertisers receive higher ratings. CR offers a great primer on replacement windows, and it also rates some of the basic manufacturers, but not all.

One key thing that I learned from CR, and this was reiterated by several other sites, is that you will greatly reduce your risk of problems down the road if you select a supplier that also handles the installation. I could have bought the windows from a home improvement company or a manufacturers rep, but if I have a problem two years from now and the company is out of business, I am looking at a huge hassle to get it resolved. If I manage to get the window manufacturer to buck up for a product warranty (and they could easily say it is an installation issue), I’m still responsible for the labor cost on the fix.

Next I did some checking on Window World. You may have seen their commercials (with the very “easy on the eyes” Kathy Ireland) or their billboards advertising the “$189 installed” replacement window. I didn’t have to do much research to confirm that I did not want $189 replacement windows. If I were selling my house in the next 90 days, or if it were a rental, I might think about it. I do not want to pay for the inefficiency of these windows (or the installation) via utilities, and I do not want to replace them in 5 to 6 years. Based on what I read, I could expect to pay between $600 and $800 for a quality product. For 14 windows, I calculated my budget to be a maximum of $11,000.

Based on manufacturers that handle the installation, I narrowed it down to three companies- Champion, Pella, and Renewal by Andersen. I set up an appointment with each via their web sites.  All three were able to come up within a few days. All wanted 90 minutes to 2 hours for their pitch and to measure. I could only give them 60 minutes. Time is valuable. If I am giving you my valuable time so you can try to sell me, please respect my time. All three would provide an estimate when they left.

Champion – this was my first appointment. They sales rep arrived right on time. He gave me the overview of the company, some basic “value” features of their product, and answered a few questions. I respected his style in that he didn’t force anything, and he listened to my questions. As we walked the house so he could measure, he kept coming back to the cues that I provided as key issues in my decision process. He was in and out in an hour, and I had a written estimate in hand when he left. The” all in” price from Champion was ~$9,800 (or about $700/window). One huge selling point, Champion offers a lifetime transferrable warranty. Since they’ve been around for over 50 years, this actually has value.

Renewal by Anderson –The rep showed up on time, but immediately said he would need 90 minutes, and if I could not provide that today, then we should reschedule. Not an option. It was today or nothing. He started talking about the awesome features of their product. RbA only does full frame composite windows, not low maintenance vinyl. It’s truly not an apples-to-apples comparison, but still worth a look. We did the walk through, and he also did much of his pitch during this time.  At the end of the hour he offered a verbal estimate, but first asked for my guess. I jokingly said $15,000 to which he asked if I wanted them installed. The price was over $30,000. Not sure when he left because I passed out.

Pella – My appointment was for 2 PM. At 2:15 I was giving up and thinking he was a no show. He arrived 5 minutes later. I told him I didn’t think he would show up, and he flippantly replied that of course he would show up. Why wouldn’t he show up? Not a good start. He next started by asking baited questions that I viewed as wasting my time. It turns out that Pella could quote 3 options – and he was trying to figure out what he had the best chance of selling. The circular conversation became exhausting, and quite frankly, I was starting to think “screw it.” I finally got him on track and we did the walk through. His flippant attitude started to grow on me. I can appreciate sarcasm, and he was actually pretty good at it. At 3:00, officially the end of his appointment, he finally started working on his estimate. He gave me a verbal quote of ~$9,300, and I had to bug him for a few days before I could get a written quote. The price was a little more than I expected because I received an advertisement that stated a $99 installation promotion. This also appeared on their website. I asked about that, and was told it’s not offered in the Kansas City market. He smiled as he said it, indicating little remorse for the confusion. Perhaps it’s not “Bait and Switch” but it sure felt like it.

Decision time - I can quickly rule out Andersen. I can’t see spending 10% of my home value on new windows. It was between Pella and Champion. Considering the lack of respect for my time (late arrival) and intelligence (condescending questions and questionable advertising tactics), I crossed Pella of the list.

I called the Champion rep, and he came out on the weekend to write up the order. Much respect for that. I would have done the same thing, especially because it was the end of the month.

It’s 7 weeks later and the job is done. The installers arrived right on time (actually a few minutes early) and wasted no time getting to it. They were extremely professional and did the job as if it were their own home. Not sure what I expected, but safe to say that they exceeded my expectations. No damage to the shrubs or lawn, and they took the time to explain the product. The one thing I did not see coming is that I cannot put the wood blinds back up. The way the replacement window slides in reduces the opening by an inch or two on all 4 sides. It also removed the wooden frame at the top where you would mount the brackets. We determined that this is not a huge issue. With new windows that we can easily clean, we don’t have the need to keep them hidden.

So far I am extremely pleased with my decision.  I firmly believe in spreading the word if you get a good value on something. With that, if you are looking for replacement windows, start by contacting Brian Andrade at Champion Windows. He’ll take care of you.

No Sanding Allowed!

About 10 years ago or so, we had hardwood floors put in our kitchen. I love the look and low maintenance of hardwoods. I also like that there are fewer problems for our allergenic/asthmatic daughter. We started thinking about hardwoods for the living room and dining room quite a few years ago. We also thought it would be nice to have hardwood floors in the bedrooms. The carpet should have been replaced 5 years ago, and since we were embarking on new windows, let’s get it all done at once.

I started by doing some research on manufacturers and suppliers. Lumber Liquidators came up with high marks as a manufacturer (for their Bellawood product line) and as a supplier of other brands. I also considered prefinished vs. unfinished. First, I like the look and how you can control where the unique boards go, and I want some cool unique boards installed. Second, I don’t want the mess of the sanding. That said, we next checked out some suppliers (Nebraska Furniture Mart and Joe’s) and didn’t see anything that jumped out as a great deal. Our last stop at Lumber Liquidators is where we hit pay dirt.

It’s an unimpressive store front, located in a warehouse building off the interstate. The showroom is rather small, but things are marked very well and the guys working there are very helpful. We stumbled on a great sale where we found oak hardwoods (20 yr warranty) for less than $3/sq ft. I also found a teak solid wood (40 yr warranty) for less than $5/sq ft. We wound up buying 800 square feet of Spice Oak from Casa de Colour and 220 square feet of Bellawood Golden Teak. Had I not hit this deal, I would have waited to see the material prices if purchased from the installer. Turns out, what I bought is about the same, maybe a little better, than buying through the installer. Next time I’d start with a quote on all the materials from the installer first.

That out of the way, I now had to find an installer. I tried finding the guy that put in our kitchen floors, and he seemingly disappeared. I also called my friend Randall (he’s done tile work for us, and used to do hardwoods). He’s out of the flooring installation business. I called Brad, who’s also done some tile work for us, and got the name of a guy he’s used in his house flipping business. Lastly, and by pure luck I got a referral from a former co-worker. With the installer that Lumber Liquidators recommends, I had three bidders.

I first called the referral from the former co-worker, Travis from Quality Flooring. He came out to provide the estimate and immediately conveyed a sense of trust. He could handle it all (picking up the flooring, moving the furniture, tinting and installing the quarter-round) and he provided a few extras (felt pads, cleaning kit, etc.) He walked through the entire process as he would do it, and pulled out a calendar to provide a timeline of his availability. When he left, I had a written estimate.

Next to stop by was CW Flooring, the company that Lumber Liquidators recommended. Shannon came by, but was running late. If you read my post on windows, you know how I feel about this. In her defense, it was raining and she came in from Belton; and at least she called to tell me she would be late. She was very thorough and precise in her approach. She measured everything to the linear and square foot, so little estimating was done. She even consulted with her husband, who actually does the installs, on transition pieces. About halfway through her visit, I learned that her daughter (around 12 years old I think) was waiting in the car. While I wasn’t worried for her safety in our neighborhood, I still encouraged Shannon to have her come in. It turns that this was a good idea as the poor girl need a rest room break. I also gave her a soda and some cookies since she was waiting for this appointment before they had lunch.  Shannon provided me a written estimate which also including everything, except that her dad would pick up the flooring and I’d pay him in cash, and they would most likely stage some of the furniture as they worked than moving it all at once. They one thing in their favor was the 10% discount from Lumber Liquidators. With that, the two bids were very close.

Lastly, I had Dave from Dave’s flooring come out. His price was 20% less than the other two, but he wouldn’t pick up the flooring and I’d have to have someone else move the furniture. He pretty much sealed his fate when asked how the Bellawood Teak is installed.

It worked out that Quality Flooring could do the install the day after the window installers finished. Perfect timing. Aaron and Daniel showed up right on time, and before I could finish the introduction they were hard at work. Within 3 hours, six rooms of carpet and pad were gone, and the floors were scrapped. Over a three day period I watched the transition occur, and was impressed by their thoroughness and efficiency. Today the floors look awesome. I am indebted to my former co-worker for a very solid referral. Nice to have friends you can trust. And with the results,  I really wish we had done it sooner!

Again, because I value referrals far more than any advertisement or promotional piece, I’m happy to recommend Quality Flooring. Great value and outstanding results. If you need some info or a quote, call Travis at 816.803.7511.

Who Shops At Stores?

Having nailed down the replacement windows and the hardwood floors, I started looking in to the last project, the carpet. I previously stated that we should have replaced the carpet 5 years earlier. That’s an understatement. It was well past due.

While were shopping for hardwoods, we also checked out carpet. Peggy knew “exactly” what she wanted. It’s pretty much what they are putting in all the new homes. This was confirmed by the carpet folks we spoke with. During our shopping experiences, I also started probing on installation costs. The biggest shock is that on stairs, installers charge $2.50 per spindle and $3.00 to wrap the edge. One flight has 4 spindles per stair, and all the stairs are open-edged and need wrapped on both sides. Ouch!

I knew that some folks had a contact that could buy the carpet at contractor prices, and didn’t add much profit to the materials. Instead they made their money on the install, and in the end it’s a good deal. The problem is that after looking around, I learned many of these folks are now doing something different. Result of the economic downturn, I guess.

Fortunately I found two folks I could work with. The first wanted me to pick out the carpet from Joe’s/Weber Carpet and he’d get the discount and do the install. But he couldn’t come by for two weeks. My good friend and former co-worker Tammy Faye recommended Carpet Direct, and gave me the name and number of the regional manager. I reached out to him, and he put me in contact with the local rep, Susan Conway.

Prior to Susan coming out to measure, I emailed her some photos of what Peggy had picked out. She showed up a few days later with some samples, and measured the two halls and the stairs. What was really nice is that she had four or five samples to look at, increasing in quality. I quickly learned that I did not want the cheapest one I was considering, and I didn’t necessarily need the high grade. I picked one in the middle that seemed to be the best value.

A few days later she provided a quote. At less than $2,000 for the carpet and install, it was about $700 less than I estimated from my conversations with NFM and Joe’s.  With this difference, I can’t imagine why anyone would buy from a retail store instead of Carpet Direct. I mailed her a check for the carpet, and she asked that I pay the installer directly.

About the time the windows were being installed, I heard from Susan that the carpet was in. We agreed on the following Monday for the install. This was after the hardwoods were done. I didn’t want the hardwood process messing up the new carpet.

Gustavo showed up on Monday morning with two guys. Like the hardwood crew, they wasted no time getting to it. Not sure I have ever seen three guys work harder, and like the hardwood and window crews, I felt like they took great pride in their work. It was if they were installing them in their own home, and were particular about how it looked. They knocked it out in one day, and again, like the other two crews, did an excellent job on the clean-up.  After they left I looked around at all the changes, and wasn’t quite sure who’s home I was in. Man, it looked nice.

So if you are looking for new carpet, do yourself a favor and start with Carpet Direct. In the Overland Park area, you can reach Susan Conway at (913) 706-8008 or stagerightkc@gmail.com.